許多亞洲國家，如中國俄羅斯日本當初的起點都和印度差不多，為什么只有印度還是那么窮？
Why is India still poor?
譯文簡介
許多亞洲國家，如俄羅斯、中國和日本，都是在與印度相同的基礎上起步的
正文翻譯
Why is India still poor?
印度為何依然貧窮？
印度為何依然貧窮？
Many Asian countries like Russia, China and Japan started on same footing as India but are not poor as India.Where did India go wrong?
許多亞洲國家，如俄羅斯、中國和日本，都是在與印度相同的基礎上起步的，但卻不像印度那樣貧窮。印度到底錯在哪里？
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許多亞洲國家，如俄羅斯、中國和日本，都是在與印度相同的基礎上起步的，但卻不像印度那樣貧窮。印度到底錯在哪里？
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Nop. Russia, , and Japan did not start out at the same footing as India. Russia and Japan both were economic/military superpower. Which means they did not skip industrial revolution. They had deeply rooted technology and global trade prowess. This means even if there was ground zero, they can easily bounce back on the foots of trained skilled labours and post WW2 US economic ties.
China and India are some what comparable. What favoraed china was No political unrests and single party which meant things went smoothly and they can do whatever they want and take any economic decision they desire. On the other hand India was too much diverse and even today none of the people are on the same page. Econlmic plans are changed every 5 years.
One thing China did smartly was making the country manufacturing hub. US saw Russia as its biggest enemy thus economic ties with China was crucial and the did some dirty work for USA as well. On the other hand India was in Russian bloc and Russia did not invest in technological development as US did in china.
Due to unskilled labour, skipping industrial revolution India had no solid ground on which techonological development can happen. Post independence India was not peacefull as we participated in many wars. Considering opposition to USA, their heavy sanctions made sure no technology from US/Europe can spread in this part of thr world. Even then we had huge potential to grow in the 90s where growth happened in China but our economic model was too impractical/outdated. We are making economic changes which China did like 40 years ago. We were just too slow to catch up. Even today, the development is relied on "quick fix" instead of sustainability. Poverty is being reduced for sure and more people are educated but class/caste/identity fights will forever drag India down.
不。俄羅斯、日本和印度的起點并不相同。俄羅斯和日本都是經濟/軍事超級大國。這意味著它們沒有跳過工業(yè)革命。它們擁有根深蒂固的技術和全球貿易能力。這意味著，即使發(fā)生了重大損失，它們也能依靠訓練有素的熟練勞動力和二戰(zhàn)后美國的經濟關系輕松反彈。
中國和印度有一定的可比性。中國的優(yōu)勢在于沒有動亂和一d制，這意味著一切都很順利，他們可以為所欲為，做出任何他們想要的經濟決策。另一方面，印度的多元化程度太高，即使到了今天，人們的意見也不盡相同。經濟計劃每 5 年就會改變一次。
中國做得最聰明的一件事就是把國家打造成制造業(yè)中心。美國將俄羅斯視為最大的敵人，因此與中國的經濟聯系至關重要，中國也為美國干了一些臟活累活。另一方面，印度屬于俄羅斯集團，俄羅斯沒有像美國對中國那樣投資于技術發(fā)展。
由于勞動力缺乏技術含量，印度跳過了工業(yè)革命，沒有堅實的技術發(fā)展基礎。獨立后的印度并不太平，因為我們參加了許多戰(zhàn)爭。考慮到反對美國，他們的嚴厲制裁確保了美國/歐洲的技術無法在印度傳播。即便如此，我們在上世紀 90 年代仍有巨大的發(fā)展?jié)摿?，當時中國也實現了增長，但我們的經濟模式過于不切實際/過時。我們正在進行經濟變革，而中國在 40 年前就已經這樣做了。我們追趕得太慢了。即使在今天，發(fā)展依靠的也是“速效”，而不是可持續(xù)性。貧困確實在減少，受教育的人也越來越多，但階級/種姓/身份之爭將永遠拖累印度。
because 50% work in agriculture sector. and its not profitable. it is highly subsidized that how those farmers make a living.
因為有 50% 的人在依靠農業(yè)生活，而且農業(yè)無利可圖。這些農民靠高額補貼為生。
Why don’t you try it? Or you can’t afford the land and don’t want to work hard?
你為什么不試一下？還是說你買不起土地，不想努力工作？
Can't afford the land. Hard work toh IT sector aur dusre businesses me bhi hota hai.
買不起地。IT行業(yè)和其他行業(yè)的工作也很辛苦。
Bcoz Bimarus keep on breeding like rats and pigs
因為北方四邦像老鼠和豬一樣繼續(xù)繁殖
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Even exclude bimarus other states is not becoming any better
即使把北方四邦摘出去，其他邦也沒有變得更好啊
A lot of states have reached middle income status by GDP per capita while BIMARU states are still lower than sub Saharan Africa.
許多邦的人均GDP已達到中等收入水平，而北方四邦的人均收入仍低于撒哈拉以南非洲地區(qū)。
Like u/peterdparker said China is the most comparable example. However, what is done cannot be undone.
What can be done to fix this?
Improve access to education and healthcare and ensure its quality. A well educated population can create good pool from which a few will rise to build an ecosystem of innovation.
Spending on research and development, especially in the Universities. India is so underfunded in this space. Don’t think there is much being spend by the government or private sector. You might hear about xyz studies or new innovation being done by foreign universities but pretty sure you rarely hear the same about Indian universities.
Incentivise people to pay taxes. Middle class working people who pay TDS would not consider pay it if our income was not trackable. There is literally no incentive for paying taxes in India. There is no income security if you suddenly become unemployed. Medical benefits offered free of charge are extremely generic and cannot cover serious illnesses and come with a lot of terms and conditions. Children’s education is a gigantic cost if you want to ensure good quality. If government starts providing these basic things to tax payers, there will be an immediate uptick in tax collection and government will not need to put taxes on the very air we breathe.
Again just my opinion.
正如 u/peterdparker 所說，中國是最有可比性的例子。然而，已經發(fā)生的事是無法挽回的。
怎樣才能解決這個問題呢？
1. 改善教育和醫(yī)療服務，并確保其質量。受過良好教育的人口可以創(chuàng)造良好的人才儲備，少數人將從中脫穎而出，建立創(chuàng)新生態(tài)系統(tǒng)。
2. 加大研發(fā)投入，尤其是大學的研發(fā)投入。印度在這方面的資金嚴重不足。不要以為政府或私營部門會投入很多資金。你可能會聽說外國大學正在進行 xyz 研究或新的創(chuàng)新，但可以肯定的是，你很少聽說印度人的大學也在進行同樣的研究或創(chuàng)新。
3. 激勵人們納稅。如果我們的收入無法追蹤，繳納 TDS 的中產階級上班族就不會考慮納稅。在印度，根本沒有鼓勵納稅的措施。如果突然失業(yè)，沒有收入保障。免費提供的醫(yī)療福利非常普通，不能涵蓋重病，而且附帶很多條款和條件。如果要確保教育質量，兒童教育是一筆巨大的開支。如果政府開始為納稅人提供這些基本服務，稅收就會立即增加，政府也就不需要對我們呼吸的空氣征稅了。
再次強調，這只是我的觀點。
Great answer, if I had to add one more thing it would be to systematically target the problem of malnutrition and stunted growth in kids from lower economic classes. The products of this are citizens that are low on IQ and can't do much, plus it perpetuates the vicious cycle of poverty and other problems.
回答得很好，如果還要補充一點的話，那就是要系統(tǒng)地解決經濟地位較低階層的孩子營養(yǎng)不良和發(fā)育遲緩的問題。否則結果就是公民智商低下，無法做很多事情，而且還會使貧困和其他問題的惡性循環(huán)持續(xù)下去。
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"Gyani log jayada hain desh mein". People think themselves no less than Socrates spl. in the rural areas.
These people are most vulnerable to propaganda by certain parties n will do anything to hamper "development n changes". This includes anything from blocking highways to voting enmass against parties/individuals.
Once the narrative is set, the bureaucracy and politicians stick to status quo, not wanting to take risks given self induced elections/transfer complications. This in return gives rise to caste politicians/Bahubalis who play the Robin hood card well, n leech off the system further.
This is how it plays out, spl. in the eastern states, where poverty is the highest. Hopefully we'll see better days in future.
“我已經什么都懂了”。在農村地區(qū)，人們認為自己并不比蘇格拉底遜色。
這些人最容易受到某些政黨宣傳的影響，他們會不惜一切代價阻礙“發(fā)展與變革”。這包括從封鎖高速公路到集體投票反對黨派/個人等一切行為。
一旦確定了某種敘事，官僚機構和政客們就會堅持現狀，不愿在自我誘導的選舉/轉移復雜化的情況下冒險。這反過來又催生了種姓政客/巴霍巴利王，他們善于打羅賓漢牌，進一步從體制中榨取利益。
在貧困率最高的東部各邦，情況就是這樣。希望我們今后會看到更好的日子。
No they did not, most other people have mentioned the reasons for Russia and Japan. But China's prosperity is very recent as well. They became the manufacturing hub of the world because of having a homogenized, lower class population at the right time and having lots of foreign investment 4-5 decades ago. That made their per capita GDP shoot up over a decent period of time now, but their demographic reality and middle income trap is catching up with them. Our PPP is increasing at a steady pace as well, but we are about 2 decades away from China due to our late start from liberalization, from the time we basically went bankrupt.
不，他們沒有，其他大多數人都提到了俄羅斯和日本的原因。但中國的繁榮也是最近才出現的。他們之所以能成為世界制造業(yè)中心，是因為在四五十年前，他們在正確的時間擁有了同質化的下層人口，并獲得了大量外國投資。這使得他們的人均 GDP 在相當長的一段時間內迅速增長，但他們的人口現實和中等收入陷阱正在趕上他們。我們的購買力平價也在穩(wěn)步增長，但由于我們的自由化起步較晚，從我們基本破產時算起，我們離中國還有大約 20 年的差距。
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Till the 1990s it was okay.. after that we got into religion issues, reservations, this that.. and for a brief amount of time people prioritised all this shitty stuff which doesn't have any relation with actual development .
Corruption at multiple levels , that led to brain drain.
And now we have this kind of political system where govts are focusing on 'how their opposition is worse than them ' rather than 'what we can do better'
And it's not about the government alone. We as citizens mostly care about our needs and demands first. Bhaad me jaaye desh ki samasya wala attitude he aadha population ka.
直到1990年代，這一切還算可以……之后我們開始陷入宗教問題、預留名額等等，短暫的時間里，人們優(yōu)先考慮這些與實際發(fā)展無關的糟糕事情。
多層次的腐敗導致了人才流失。
而現在我們又有了這種政府關注的是“他們的對手比他們更糟糕”，而不是“我們能做得更好”的政治體制。這不僅僅是政府的問題。作為公民，我們大多數人首先關心的是自己的需求和要求。半數人口都有“國家的問題與我無關”的態(tài)度。
India is one of the richest country of the world.
Indians are poor because we are too many.
印度是世界上最富有的國家之一。
印度人很窮，因為我們人太多了。
China vs india
Both countries start from same line
India choosed Russia vs china choosed western countries
China got massive investments, technology transfer from western countries now become manufacturing hub of world
India got sanctions, internal conflicts, wars from neighbor countries and isolated from world
What present India is doing is China did 30 years back
Choosing Russia in history is biggest mistake we still facing that heat
中國對比印度
兩國的出發(fā)點相同
印度選擇了俄羅斯，而中國選擇了西方國家
中國從西方國家獲得大量投資和技術轉讓，現在已成為世界制造業(yè)中心
印度則受到制裁、內部沖突和鄰國的戰(zhàn)爭，被世界孤立
現在的印度所做的，正是 30 年前的中國所做的
選擇俄羅斯是歷史上最大的錯誤，我們仍然面臨著這個問題
Which year was it? Weren't we under colonial rule or are you talking after post independence?
你說的是哪一年？是殖民統(tǒng)治時期還是獨立后？
Because we refuse to work 70 hours a week!
因為我們拒絕每周工作 70 小時！
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Because certain regions are continuously breeding and giving rise to more poor folks...
因為某些地區(qū)不斷繁衍生息，產生了更多的窮人...
overpopulation plus socialist schemes
人口過剩加上社會主義計劃
Religion
宗教
Lack of good governance (only a few like PM Manmohan Singh exist)
No one in government actually understands how good governance works.
Lack of the people's will to improve the nation.
Hatred accepted, and sometimes, explicitly promoted and acted upon by politicians.
Lack of social protection (No retirement savings through work).
Lack of good government schemes to secure people's assets / retirement.
Lack of senior care/programs (people ages 65+)
Lack of good health care for the average citizen
Education system relying heavily on rote memorization, not practical understanding of how things work.
Value of life per capita very low.
No idea how the world works, how the world functions with each other, how the world sees India. Only now India is beginning to understand how to navigate political affairs at an international level.
缺乏良好的治理（只有曼莫漢-辛格總理等少數人）
政府中沒有人真正了解良好的治理是如何運作的。
人民缺乏改善國家的意愿。
政客們接受仇恨，有時甚至明確宣揚仇恨并付諸行動。
缺乏社會保障（沒有通過工作儲蓄退休）。
缺乏良好的政府計劃來保障人民的資產/退休生活。
缺乏老年護理/計劃（65 歲以上人群）
普通民眾缺乏良好的醫(yī)療保健服務
教育系統(tǒng)嚴重依賴死記硬背，而不是切實了解事物是如何運作的。
人均生命價值非常低。
不知道世界是如何運轉的，不知道世界是如何相互運作的，不知道世界是如何看待印度的。印度現在才開始了解如何處理國際政治事務。
wait till i assume power hahahahah
等我掌權再說吧，哈哈哈哈
India has a huge population of 1.5 Billion people. Out of this close to 80 crore are getting free food and are happily reproducing.
Another 10 crore are busy with stupid UPSC, railways, PCS and other government exams to ensure they continue to keep India poor by siphoning Tax collection and Government Allocation.
Another 10 crore are working towards becoming with Engineers, doing BA/MA and many other useless degrees to join the above population group.
Another 40 crore are still studying and confused about their gender.
Pending 10 crore are lifting the weight of all of above.
Other countries are doing well e.g. Russia, Europe and Japan due to lesser population and strong work ethics.
印度擁有 15 億人口。其中近 8 億人在免費獲取食物，并快樂地繁衍后代。
另有 1 億人忙于愚蠢的 UPSC、鐵路、PCS 和其他政府考試，以確保他們繼續(xù)通過抽取稅收和政府撥款來維持印度的貧窮。
另有 1 億人正在努力成為工程師，攻讀學士/碩士學位和其他許多無用的學位，以加入上述人群。
另有 4 億人仍在學習，對自己的性別感到困惑。
剩下的1億人則承受著上述所有人的重擔。
其他國家，如俄羅斯、歐洲和日本，由于人口較少和強烈的職業(yè)道德，發(fā)展勢頭良好。
China's growth is completely artificial, japan licked America's ass and SK too. We were independent, and we wanted to look after our interests, we didn't want to be the puppet of America. And coming to Russia, remove it's oil, apart from it I do not think that it will sustain itself if not for the vast resources it was gifted.
中國的增長完全是吹起來的，日本和韓國靠舔美國的屁股。我們是獨立的，我們想照顧自己的利益，我們不想成為美國的傀儡。說到俄羅斯，除去它的石油，如果不是因為它擁有大量的資源，我認為它根本無法維持自身的發(fā)展。
if china's growth is artificial they why are countries so afraid of this false economy.
如果中國的經濟增長是人吹起來的，為什么各國如此害怕這種虛假的經濟？
China is the factory of the world. It's growth is completely genuine. Just visit Shanghai once. You will cry at the pathetic state of India.
中國是世界工廠。它的發(fā)展是完全真實的。只要去一次上海。你會為印度的悲慘狀況而哭泣。
Yea, by forcing it's labour to work hard hours and paying peanuts. Have you heard about what used to happen in foxcon factory?
是啊，通過強迫勞工長時間工作并支付花生米的工資。你聽說過富士康工廠曾經發(fā)生的事情嗎？
Bro is just china hater not accepting the truth sometimes move outside the country.
Bro 只是仇視中國，不接受事實，有時去國外看看吧。
你大錯特錯。世界上到處都是中國制造，大多數消費品都是中國制造。
less freebies, government needs to give more freebies.
//
On a serious note, russia china have a different kind of government and growth is faster and unidirectional.
Japan was never invaded.
India has always been the good guy/girl unfortunately.
免費贈品還是少了，政府需要提供更多的免費贈品。
認真地說，俄羅斯和中國的政府類型不同，而且增長更快、更單向。
日本從未遭受過入侵。
不幸的是，印度一直都是好男孩\\\\女孩類型。
Post-WW2 American Allied Occupation of Japan happened.
Japan was completely wrecked after the war, and they recovered through foreign aid and capitalist economic policy.
The benefit Japan had was that they already had Industries before the war, but so did India.
二戰(zhàn)后，美國盟軍占領了日本。
日本在戰(zhàn)后被徹底摧毀，通過外國援助和資本主義經濟政策才得以恢復。
日本的優(yōu)勢在于戰(zhàn)前已經擁有工業(yè)，但印度也是如此。
okay
but imagine India being invaded and looted from time to time for hundred of years vs Japan being occupied only for 7 years (1945 to 1952). Funny thing is we still follow ancient traditions (saying in a good way) even though invaders came and went away.
Japan has sustainable businesses which are as old as 1000 years.
Like to like comparison is not right.
Also I don't believe India has poor people. It's a new land of opportunities if one is willing to work hard, he/she wont be poor for sure.
好吧
但想象一下，印度數百年來不時遭到侵略和掠奪，而日本只被占領了 7 年（1945 年至 1952 年）。有趣的是，即使侵略者來了又走了，我們仍然沿襲著古老的傳統(tǒng)（說的是好的方面）。
日本擁有一些持續(xù)千年歷史的產業(yè)。
點對點比較是不對的。
我也不相信印度有窮人。 如果一個人愿意努力工作，這里是一個新的機會之地，他/她肯定不會貧窮。
Because of low iq, this is caused by religion and cast system . They can be easily manipulated because of low IQ ask the British they ruled them for 400 years
因為智商低，這是宗教和等級制度造成的。因為智商低，他們很容易被操縱，問問統(tǒng)治了他們 400 年的英國人吧
Defense industry is the driver for any country to become a military superpower, our defense industry is choking on the dick of our bureaucracy.
國防工業(yè)是任何國家成為軍事超級大國的驅動力，而我們的國防工業(yè)卻被官僚主義扼住了喉嚨。
Because the western intelligence agencies wanted us to be poor, so they keep putting people in power that will do their jobs instead of running the nation how it should be.
Currently they want us to stop China from becoming too powerful, so we need to take some of their exports away.
因為西方情報機構希望我們貧窮，所以他們不斷讓一些人上臺，讓他們從中作梗，而不是按照國家應該有的方式管理國家。
目前，他們希望我們阻止中國變得過于強大，所以我們需要奪走他們的一些出口產品。
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網 http://www.top-shui.cn 轉載請注明出處
There is no innovation, no ambition, no industry. Some of it is due to government regulations over the year, some due to excessive bureaucracy and corruption, and some of it is due to our subservient mentality. From birth our parents force us to find a stable government job, or force us down medical/engineering paths. Even our education system advocates for rote learning over coming up with new ideas.
沒有創(chuàng)新，沒有雄心，沒有產業(yè)。這其中有些是由于政府常年的監(jiān)管，有些是由于過度的官僚主義和腐敗，還有些是由于我們的順從心態(tài)。從一出生，我們的父母就強迫我們找一份穩(wěn)定的政府工作，或者強迫我們走醫(yī)學/工程學的道路。甚至我們的教育系統(tǒng)也提倡死記硬背，而不是提出新的想法。